Talk:Artoria Pendragon (Rider Alter)/@comment-24897897-20171202120154/@comment-2604:6000:C9CE:9300:B172:DDC4:948B:5641-20171231030512

FYI - Medusa is also a Rider with Independent Action (Rank C).

Also, I'm looking at the numbers and I think Maid Alter has Kintoki beat in terms of NP damage. She has ~1000 more attack than he does without Grails, the same 20%-30% Quick buff, and her 1st skill has another 10%-20% Quick buff that falls between Kintoki's 100% and 200% Overcharge effects. But she also has a 20%-30% raw Attack buff and is capable of double-stacking her Reload. Kintoki's only real advantage is that he's a welfare Servant so he should be NP5 while Maid Alter is a 5 star and will be NP1 unless you are lucky or a whale. And even then the numbers are close:

Maid Alter (NP 1, no double Reload): 10,776 * 1.3 * 12 = 168,106 * 1.5 = 252,158

Kintoki Rider (NP 5, Lv 1 Overcharge): 9,819 * 20 = 196,380 * 1.4 = 274,932 + 150 = 275,082

Maid Alter (NP 1, double Reload): 10,776 * 1.3 * 12 = 168,106 * 1.8 = 302,590

Maid Alter (NP 2, no double Reload): 10,776 * 1.3 * 16 = 224,141 * 1.5 = 336,211

Kintoki (NP 5, Lv 3 Overcharge): 9,819 * 20 = 196,380 * 1.8 = 353,484

Maid Alter (NP 2, double Reload): 10,776 * 1.3 *16 = 224,141 * 1.8 = 403,454

Using his entire kit and assuming he is Brave Chaining his NP so it is only at 100% charge, Kintoki only barely out-damages Maid Alter using her entire kit without double-stacking Reload. If Maid Alter doubles her Reload bonus then she out-damages NP5 Kintoki even at NP1. The only way for Kintoki to out-damage an NP2 or higher Maid Alter is by using his Overcharge bonus and even then he would have to get 400% or 500% charge, meaning he would have to NP Chain and not Brave Chain his NP. Maid Alter's 3 turn Quick buff may be weaker, but the 3 turn raw Attack buff tacked on making it affect her Arts and Buster cards as well, plus her Independent Action, means she will also out-Crit Kintoki and do more damage overall.

Here's a video I just watched of an NP5 Maid Alter doing 905,000 damage to Goetia with just her NP.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4c28ZpIs84