Talk:SE.RA.PH/@comment-29027964-20170511024554/@comment-28048698-20170511075701

I wanted to continue with this discussion before going to sleep. :P

@Tubtub: Sorry, I said the thing about being offended because sometimes when I tried to deeply discuss something with someone, with arguments and facts, they feel like I'm attacking them personally or something like that (that's the problem of talking in forums, withouth hearing the other person's voice).

First of all I must say that I agree with a very important point both you and someone else said already: Meltlilith is a selfish-type Servant (it reminds me Mordred a little). Being a Single Target DPS, her main goal is to deal with big enemies, and being selfish she needs a team that is created for her. With that, she can fight without any problem.

Also I need to say that I was wrong about a number before (thanks, FGOHikaru!), Meltlilith's Melt Virus reduce up to 50% of the NP damage. That is a lot. Against a Single Target boss NP is a great decrease (but probably will still kill someone), and against a AoE boss NP your team will survive without any problem.

About comparing with Cú Alter and Jeanne Alter, the big problem is how those two are totally broken. Usually I try to not compare anyone with them. The same is when we talk about supports, it's a bad idea to compare any support with Waver or Merlin, they are totally broken. However, it can be good to compare Melt with Scathach and Jack. And after looking at their stats, it's funny what I saw.

Scathach, Jack and Meltlilith are Quick and Critical oriented Servants. Well, Scathach not that much. And the things is... Meltlilith have the highest star absortion amongs those three. Jack have 97, Scathach have 88, and Meltlilith have 100. If we talk about ATK (because at this point we are talking about damage), Jack the Reaper have 11.557, Scathach have 11.375, and Meltlilith have 11.692. Meltlilith have the highest ATK amongs those three. However, Jack is still the best if we talk about Star generation (25,5% against Scathach's 12,2% and Meltlilith's 10,2%), and about NP charge per attack (1,07% against Scathach's 0,71% and Mellilith's 0,92%).

So if we talk about raw damage, Meltlilith (with higher Star Absortion and ATK) is better. Now if we talk about how good they are surviving (and we talk about dodge skills and HP at this point), Jack and Scathach have 1 turn dodge, while Meltlilith have 2 hits dodge. Jack HP is 12.696, Scathach HP is 14.825, and Meltlilith HP is 13.402. Her HP is higher than Jack and lower than Scathach, she is the second best with this.

What is better between turn-dodges and hit-dodges? Both are goods depending on the situation. However, if we talk about numbers and chances, Meltlilith only have 33% of being attacked, usually the enemies have a total of three attacks per turn, so the "usual" will be to receive one attack each turn. Of course, there is a difference between just chances and the reality, but this can give us an idea. The important thing is when to use the skill.

The normal situation against a boss is to keep your dodge until the NP. If the dodge is 1 turn, the enemy will do his/her NP, maybe will attack you, and that's all. However, the good thing about the 2-hits dodge is you will keep the buff even after the debuff if the enemy don't attack you after that (and it can happen; sometimes the boss use a skill after the NP, or sometimes attack someone else). So I'm not going to say that her dodge is better than Jack's or Scathach, but it can be more flexible. Maybe risky (you can be unlucky and the enemy can do a full assault against her) but flexible.

There is another important thing to say about the difference between Scathach, Jack and Melt. Both Scathach and Jack are Servants that can be monster in some situations. Jack against females, Scathatch against Divine/Undead. Meltlilith doesn't have that kind of specialization, but she can do bonus damage to three classes (Rider/Caster/Assassin) instead of only one (Rider or Archer).

And what if we talk about the self-bonuss from the three of them? Jack can receive +50% Quick, Scathach can recive +50% Quick, Melt only receive +30% ATK. However, Jack and Scathach buff only cover Quick, while Melt buff cover all attacks. Also, if you combine Melt's ATK buff with NP's buff you receive a higher bonus: 1,3 (Sadist) x 1,2 (Melt Virus) = 1,56 (Total). That is 56% bonus damage to her NP.

It's true that she isn't THAT OP to receive those demerits. But it's also true that her demerits are really sillies. The -10% DEF is very little, and like someone said before you can cover that with Crime Ballet (same CD and all). The party NP's debuff is also silly. If you use Melt Virus to defend, just don't use your damage NP that turn (it isn't THAT important, only a very few times); if you are using this Servant you know when to buff her. If you use it to boost your NP, just anticipate when to attack.

What is my conclusion? She isn't a god-tier like Cú Alter or Jeanne Alter, maybe she isn't either a top-tier like Jack or Scathach (only because they are gods in their specialization, and because they have more utility, not only raw damage), but if Cú Alter and Jeanne Alter are EX rank, and Scathach and Jack are A++ rank, I would say Melt is A+ if you use it the way she is supposed to be used.

I exhort you to try her with a team that can provide her some stars (it will be better if they give stars with skills, instead of just with Quick Cards). I don't know who are your Servants, and the options are countless. Helena can give stars, damage and NP charge. Hans can give ATk, DEF, critical damage and stars. Vlad III Extra can be useful against Archers, because he can taunt one turn, give stars, and boost NP damage, Merlin is godlike with her because Illusion boost Star Generation, he can boost ATK and critical damage, create stars with his NP, and protect her with Illusion, Waver can help too, against Riders or Berserker EMIYA (Assassin) is useful because he can taunt and create stars, while helping with some Arts cards, etc, etc.

In Meltlilith's article someone (maybe it's the same Fandom User that is commenting her) talked about using Nero Bride with her, and the idea is perfect. Nero Bride can give her ANYTHING she needs, so you can use that combo against Lancers (and you help her with those Lancers too, because she only deals 50%).

She isn't that hard or complex, but she can't be used in the usual DPS way of "HULK SEE ENEMIES, HULK DESTROY". She needs a team for her, like a selfish person.

Aaaaaand sorry if I forgot something or had any mistake. D: 3:54 a.m here, but really wanted to comment before going to sleep, this discussion is interesting.

Oh, btw, sorry if my point #9 make you feel offended before. >_< I'm honest when I said my intention is to help looking a way to make her shine. After using her a lot in this event I saw how powerful she can be with a strategy that focus totally on her.