Talk:Gilgamesh/@comment-31760473-20170504051711/@comment-28048698-20170515145138

@Valeth: I totally agree with you in something: "Serious Gil" is better than "Overconfident Gil", and probably we can count with only one hand the Servants that can beat him when he fight seriously.

The problem is that: when Gilgamesh is serious, and when Gilgamesh is overconfident? Let's remember Gilgamesh is a king, and a king with a huge ego. He consider Iskandar worthy not only because he have a lot of charisma and because he had a great legend. It's also because Iskandar himself is a king. Tomorrow they can create a broken Servant, even more powerful than Gilgamesh, but if that Servant is a vagabond Gilgamesh will never respect him. Probably he will unleash his full power at mid battle saying "I won't let a mongrel like you humillate a king like me".

So... "Being respected by Gilgamesh or considered worthy by him" isn't the same as "being powerful or being capable of beating him". To Gilgamesh it doesn't matter your power. Against Heracles, Gil only respected God Hand's power, and maybe, just maybe, Heracles loyalty toward Illya (just like Waver's loyalty towards Iskandar).

Kirei order was a deciding factor. The Servants can resist Command Spell's order, yes, but that will cause them a lot of pain, and a drop in their stats. So Kirei order restain Cu from fighting with all his might, and disobeying his order will cause him pain and drop in stats, so he is screwed in both ways. Here we have an explanation about the drop in the ranks:

"Normally a command like "obey my every order completely" could not be done even with one hundred Command Spells, but a powerful enough Master can change the effect from "well, I'll respect Master's opinions slightly" to dropping them a rank if they disagree with the Master"

About bad Masters and Karna... Bad example. In Extra and CCC the Master doesn't give mana to the Servant (because in that world the mana doesn't exist anymore), and the Master strengthen the Servant via data recollection. So even someone like Emiya Shirou can give a huge boost of stats to someone like Heracles with that method.

And... Gilgamesh really have omnidirectional protection? Until now the few omnidirectional protection we know are exclusive of those Servants (Karna's armor, Heracles's God Hand, Artoria's Avalon). If I remember correctly we don't know a single omnidirectional protection that can be inside GoB. But maybe I'm wrong, I don't remember every single NP.

That's why I still think Cu can beat "overcondifent Gil", and I also think Gil will be always "overconfident Gil" toward someone like Cu, considered a "dog". Even if Cu fight against him twelve hours, one day or a whole week.